Time to Bring the Men's Squad Back East

[crewu]

My personal opinion but I think that a training program that uproots a bunch of rowers who are already in one place to go somewhere else for a few weeks/months to train with a different coach and do some seat racing and then go back before then going somewhere else completely for more training with completely different coaches and then go overseas twice and not have their own coach officially recognized is a truly fcuk-ed up system. Poor results alone might not do Josy in but the way he is conducting this circus certainly will. His plan completely disregards the geographic size of this country.

I can only hope the format is cleaner and clearer in 2023.

[Mango]

My personal opinion but I think that a training program that uproots a bunch of rowers who are already in one place to go somewhere else for a few weeks/months to train with a different coach and do some seat racing and then go back before then going somewhere else completely for more training with completely different coaches and then go overseas twice and not have their own coach officially recognized is a truly fcuk up system. Poor results alone might not do Josy in but the way he is conducting this circus certainly will. His plan completely disregards the geographic size of this country.

I can only hope the format is cleaner and clearer in 2023.

I wish I could upvote this into oblivion.

[rowing]

It was rather accurate, wasn't it?

[Faster-n-faster]

My personal opinion but I think that a training program that uproots a bunch of rowers who are already in one place to go somewhere else for a few weeks/months to train with a different coach and do some seat racing and then go back before then going somewhere else completely for more training with completely different coaches and then go overseas twice and not have their own coach officially recognized is a truly fcuk up system. Poor results alone might not do Josy in but the way he is conducting this circus certainly will. His plan completely disregards the geographic size of this country.

I can only hope the format is cleaner and clearer in 2023.

But guys it’s “athlete-focused”

[Mango]

My personal opinion but I think that a training program that uproots a bunch of rowers who are already in one place to go somewhere else for a few weeks/months to train with a different coach and do some seat racing and then go back before then going somewhere else completely for more training with completely different coaches and then go overseas twice and not have their own coach officially recognized is a truly fcuk up system. Poor results alone might not do Josy in but the way he is conducting this circus certainly will. His plan completely disregards the geographic size of this country.

I can only hope the format is cleaner and clearer in 2023.

But guys it’s “athlete-focused”

I do think the "current" model can work. But it needs a strong administrator to corral the athletes, coaches, locations in an impactful, inclusive, and organized way.

This is not that....

He will have to adapt/improve or he will have to recentralize and cut out the clubs.

[crewu]

My personal opinion but I think that a training program that uproots a bunch of rowers who are already in one place to go somewhere else for a few weeks/months to train with a different coach and do some seat racing and then go back before then going somewhere else completely for more training with completely different coaches and then go overseas twice and not have their own coach officially recognized is a truly fcuk up system. Poor results alone might not do Josy in but the way he is conducting this circus certainly will. His plan completely disregards the geographic size of this country.

I can only hope the format is cleaner and clearer in 2023.

I wish I could upvote this into oblivion.

From the recent Rowing News
https://www.rowingnews.com/2023/03/01/n ... hard-part/
“Last year, I was a stupid Dutchman,” he said, staging selection events in Florida and New Jersey, to which athletes had to travel and move boats after having traveled and moved boats for training camps for the speed-order and selection regattas. This year, the training camps are paired with the selection events, and “we pick up the bill” for the invited Olympic-event athletes, Verdonkschot said.


OK Josy is adapting. This switch alone could be enough to get the big boats onto the podium. Looking forward to better things this year. I won't deny he will be a God if the men's and women's eights make the podium and he keeps the women's pair and lightweight 2X clicking. The ingredients for magic are also there in the women's sculling squad. And if Josy can convince Teti to prepare a men's pair (or 4-, or both?) to double into the eight? Oh my there's potential for a medal haul. Freaken USA baby!

I have never been a proponent for doubling at worlds but evidence presented by successful rowing nations has made this clearly credible.

[fullmetal]

When reached by Rowing News in late February, he noted that “tomorrow” would be the first day off for the athletes and that the group’s best 2,000-meter erg scores showed significant improvement across the squad, from the lightweight women (7:00) to heavyweight men (5:43).

Okay, this is tangible progress.

“Last year, I was a stupid Dutchman,” he said...

I respect the honesty/pragmatism. The last thing I need to do is start hoping, but I have a little more optimism in the show-me camp now. I think he is indirectly referencing his realization of the geographic travel burden of centralizing selection events. Would that transport were not such a huge deal...welcome to the US of A.

[lt.wolf]

Are we as Americans too hung up on the eight ? Isn’t it the perfect event to double up into ?

[fullmetal]

Yes, probably hung up on the eight for tradition/sentiment. Doubling up? Why compromise two events when we haven't proven capable of medaling in one? I'm not opposed in principle, but you gotta show me something here...

[FullSend]

I like the idea of doubling up top athletes. If it works, you should be able to qualify more boats for Paris and then you can pick what you think your best opportunities on to focus on for next year.

If 8 athletes qualify the 2-, 4-, and 8+ but are more competitive in the 4- and 2- than the 8+. You can have then set priority next year accordingly. (Or sculling events or whatever you like)

The "if" is doing a lot of work in my statement. To me it comes down to do you think doubling up causes you to miss qualifying a boat you would have qualified otherwise. Seems like a fairly low risk - top athletes doubling are probably stronger than athletes 9-14.

[fullmetal]

Seems like a fairly low risk - top athletes doubling are probably stronger than athletes 9-14.

In the same regatta? If we're qualifying different boats in different regattas, sure (assuming the athletes aren't trying to peak for qualifying). But doubling up in the same regatta seems tough, even for athletes 1-8. And surely athletes 1-8 having raced already might not be as fast as fresh 9-14. If the practice pieces bear it out, then sure.

[crewu]

Have a look at how many Olympic rowing medalists in Tokyo raced in two events. There's a lot.

[fullmetal]

We don't even have folks on the squad who have a single Olympic medal, much less the track record to win two. I'm not against doubling, I'm just not sure we should swing for that fence when one medal is a much needed sign of progress. Don't tell me a 4th place M4- and a 4th place M8+ with the four doubling would be a good result.

[crewu]

I'd tell you the best four doubling into the eight could yield a better result.

It changes the entire training program with more time spent in smaller boats rather than just hammering it out constantly in the eight.

[FullSend]

There's 2 perspectives here. As an individual athlete, you have a worse chance in each event you're doubling in than you would otherwise. As a federation double racing your top athletes gives you a better combined result (two bronze instead of maybe a silver and 7th let's say).

I think in a an Olympic qualification year, it makes sense to double for worlds - better chance at qualifying more boats, get a feel for what events you feel better about. Then using that information pick your best bet and go full speed at it.

This is all incredibly situation dependent. If you're the US Women in 2016 you don't need to worry about much of this because you're so deep anyways. If you have some generational talents, they can handle doubling up better. Does NZ have another medal or 2 in the 8+ if they double up Bond/Murray in 12 and 16?