New C2 Blade

[Faster-n-faster]

C2 released a new blade (quietly?). Looks like a pro version of the bantam blade and rigs closer to a smoothie blade than a Fat2. Will be interesting to see how it’s received.

[rowing]

Looks like a straight rip off of Dreher's Apex RE and ERX blades with Mick Jagger's lips stapled to the end.

Next.

[Stelph]

Looks like a "performance" Bantam blade out of carbon fibre, interesting to see they are pushing this as the new ideal shape.

As rowing says, they do look a lot like the Dreher round blades - I had a set back in the day and they were excellent to scull with, I always battled with the rigging however as like the Fat2's there wasn't really a consensus as to the best rig - I suspect that's why they and the Fat2's never really took off, probably why C2 are highlighting that these can be rigged the same as the smoothies.

Would like to see some testing data comparing them to the smoothie blades

[JD]

talked W/ Pete when the Bantam blade came out. He said that the inner part of the smoothies and fat2's didn't do much work, and that they found there was really no difference in propulsion with the Bantam. I guess that's half of the thinking with this stubby blade. The other half is that if you are in a club situation like I've been for a while, it's hard having Fat's and Smoothies because you have to rig the Fats with less spread/span. That means either less interchangeability between shared boats or a whole lot more rigging.

[rowing]

What a load of nonsense in that explanation. If there's no difference in propulsion, where is the Bantam at Worlds?

The inside portions may not do much propulsive work, mostly because of the orientation of the stroke arc and the ratio of the catch angle vs. the finish angle, but the inner edge does a lot for stability in the last portion of the stroke.

The wider a blade is, the greater risk of pitch instability during the stroke because the torque forces have more advantage over the sleeve sitting in the lock. If you take a perfect stroke, no problem. If you dig or skate, the wider blade amplifies that misstep compared to a narrower blade.

The stubbier a blade is, the greater risk of pitch instability because you don't have the inside portion of the blade helping to hold the blade steady as you move past perpendicular and begin the small amount of back-watering connection. That inside portion helps to guide the water flow, somewhat more gently due to distributive qualities, and you avoid likely rock and shock as you exit. Propulsion is not the name of the game here, but stability is. How you leave the water will influence your recovery and the next stroke.

Blades like this are meant for short jabby strokes at very high ratings. There is no longer connection to be savored because there is less surface to connect in the first place. If that's your style, this might be your blade.

[eeoyre]

What a load of nonsense in that explanation. If there's no difference in propulsion, where is the Bantam at Worlds?

The Bantam was specifically created to be a low cost option for youth, beginner, and rec sculling, and it's made out of injection molded plastic. This new blade seems to actually be aimed at the high performance market, so we'll probably get an answer to your question in July and August.

[KitD]

The wider a blade is, the greater risk of pitch instability during the stroke because the torque forces have more advantage over the sleeve sitting in the lock. If you take a perfect stroke, no problem. If you dig or skate, the wider blade amplifies that misstep compared to a narrower blade.

A use-case for RandallFoils?

[rowing]

The wider a blade is, the greater risk of pitch instability during the stroke because the torque forces have more advantage over the sleeve sitting in the lock. If you take a perfect stroke, no problem. If you dig or skate, the wider blade amplifies that misstep compared to a narrower blade.

A use-case for RandallFoils?

Hmmm....you might have something there. FatFoils?

[lt.wolf]

I am willing to try them out, always wanting to see what is out there

[rowing]

That is the only proper mindset, and kudos for declaring it.

Really getting tired of people just assuming because a manufacturer has launched a new product that clearly the science must be settled. So much of new iterations are just rehashes of old iterations but no one bothers to recall.

Release date does not imply superiority. You have to find the boat, oar, erg, trou that fits YOU.

[catdailey]

I’d love to try these. Maybe I’ll get a chance at Craftsbury this July. It does look as if the Comp is the Bantam, but in carbon rather than fiberglass. It’s interesting to see that on the C2 website, the Bantam blade is compared to the Fat2, but from its tip. The Comp is compared to the Smoothie, but from the shaft end. And if the Comp is indeed a “better” Bantam with a vortex edge, it’s curious to see that the recommended shaft length for the Bantam blade is shorter than a traditional smoothie shape, but longer than the Fat2. Sort of a “tweener” length. It doesn’t look as if they’re recommending a shorter shaft length for the Comp. From the website:

Blade Recommended Length
Smoothie2 Plain Edge 284–289
Bantam 281–286
Fat2 278–283

[caustic]

imma just sit over here with my 15 year old S2 softies.

[lt.wolf]

A few notes passed along on the blades

The end of the blade is squared, the Apex is rounded, so out at the tip of the blade there is 7-8-9 more square inches of blade area. So the push point and stability of the end of the blade will be different for the COMP versus the APEX

The other dynamic re blade shape is the bottom lower half is carved off... which based on what Dick D and the test row informed us that it makes it feel lighter at the very end of the stroke.

The oar gets geared on the outboard like a Smoothie, the vortex edge would mean 0.5cm less outboard than a naked blade edge

The puddle was different than a Smoothie, which I'm guessing has to do with more of the blade area being out on the very end of the oar.

[rowing]

Apex REX, ER, and the ERX are also squared at the tip. There is no mistaking the similarity of that profile. Hats off to the Drehers for finally moving the needle on an interesting design. Something about imitation and flattery, right?

[Long'n Strong]

Wait, no foil?